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The Rattler is, essentially, as. All three-rifle barrels were marked 5.56 NATO. If the Mk4T had either of the triggers found on the SIG Sauer or Springfield Armory carbines, it might have been the accuracy champ of this test. All content is 2006-2015 Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association. Let's pick up there. After some time and the Rattler was more widely seen in the wild. The AR pistol is a platform of many uses. They screwed up, realize it, and took care of the problem. I took the Saint victor home and that's all it wrote for me . (Most folks will never see such high velocities out of the 5.5 inch barrel.) We tested our 1:7/1:8-twist-barreled carbines with 60-grain V-Max 223 Remington rounds plus 5.56mm ammunition topped with 69-grain OTM (open-tipped match), 77-grain OTM, and 77-grain TMK (tipped Match King) rounds from Black Hills Ammunition. When you authored this on 24 March 2020, SIG announced the 716I Tread for civilian sale which is the same rifle minus select fire, 1913 rails on the handguards 6', and an M-Lok Bayonet lug. Support gear used:***Splatterburst Targetshttps://amzn.to/2Kera7g***Peltor Sport RangeGuard Hearing Protectionhttps://amzn.to/2LsLUbXThe Springfield XDM Elit. AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types. As was the case with the M400 Classic, the front sight was not visible with the Tango4 optical scope mounted. Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. Soldiers and law enforcement who wear plates or body armor might not complain about the bare-plastic buttplate, but most shooters will want something more friendly. To keep my support hand from creeping up on the muzzle, I added an M-LOK-compatible Kinesthetic Angled Grip (KAG) from Bravo Company Manufacturing (BCM) to the forend. Decibels dont drop like flies with every load. PDW stands for personal defense weapon. It is not a term that Springfield Armory invented. I have builds from BCM, Springfield, Noveske and PSA. The new RIA 5.0 Sporting Pistol from Rock Island Armory features a patented RVS Recoil system that maximizes barrel mass and linear movement to give shooters super soft recoil. If I did buy another SIG rifle it would be the 716 to replace my Victor .308 (most know my issues with this gun). The TaurusTX 22 Compact delivers class-leading reliability, capacity, and shootability in a 22 LR platform, and it's cut for a slide-mounted mini red dot. At the rear of the receiver, youll see the Maxim Defense SCW brace. With the stock folded, the gun is only 16 inches long, making it the shortest 300 Blackout weapon on the market. Has anyone actually tried the omega 9k on the rattler? It is everywhere and inexpensive, especially when compared to those two boutique cartridges. Their latest addition is the Saint Edge PDW AR pistol, and Im sure it will get its large slice of the AR pie. Although the drill was shot cold, we couldnt help but be more warmed up by the time we reached the third gun. Springfield Armorys $899 Saint, the manufacturers first AR-15, was treated to a Bravo Company BCM Gunfighter stock and Keymod handrail. and at a gun show I saw the Sig Cross bolt rifle . Love my M400 Tread and if I was in the market for another AR Rifle, i'd absolutely consider it. I had several concerns due to its comically short barrel, its accuracy, reliability and velocity. A final note, the Protector is a very shootable pistol, thanks in part to its heft (a shade under 6 pounds). I just started a new thread under Sig Rifles to cover Vrtus Patrol. Fitting right into this slot is the Saint Victor 300 Blackout Pistol. Also visible with the top end hinged away was the Accu-Tite tension system consisting of a synthetic non-marring screw that mated flush beneath the bottom of the connecting lug. To order a copy and subscribe, visitoutdoorgroupstore.com. With its A1 front-sight assembly, two-piece plastic handguard and M4 buttstock, the M400 Classic did not appear to be a carbine with the type of upgrades we were looking for. After our run with the Saint, all three targets showed five hits. In addition to all that, for the features you get on this pistol, it is priced very reasonably. Im sure some of the attention it will initially get will be negative from people who feel the same way. Higher-level shooters might prefer a hard break without overture, but its certainly not a distraction that will inhibit the experienced shooter. Would I want to get shot with it at 200 yards? From the beginning, we discovered an inordinate amount of creep in the trigger. The Rattler runs a very dependable gas-piston system, which eliminates all the fouling typical in these short-barreled configurations. This round was designed to offer terminal ballistics similar to the AKs 7.62x39mm while still being compatible with AR-style rifles, requiring only a barrel change. Can the SIG MCX Rattler do it? The BCM Gunfighter buttstock offered sleek lines with no protruding levers that might catch on gear, such as the straps of a chest rig. I actually sold my Sig m400 patrol 5.56 , And My Sig P320 . Any ways I just bought the Springfield Saint Victor in .308 . Granted you give up some ballistic performance, but gain a gat easy to transport and, yes, conceal (say in a backpack). The old-fashioned buttpad didnt bother us because it was properly fit, but wed definitely change out the grip. Awesome pistol by the way. SIG Sauer MCX-SPEAR: Civilian Version of XM7 Rifle Arrives! a little more then I've ever spent on a gun .So I called it a holy grail gun , which I had many other guns in front of that one . All Rights Reserved. We set up a three-target array with just 10 feet between each target. Springfield incorporates some nice accessories from Reptilia Corp. like the CQG pistol grip, which has a more vertical angle than the standard AR grip. Instead, its plenty accurate for its intended purpose. Your welcome BET7, I've looked at the Christensen Arms and pretty sweet , Also was dead set on getting a Danial defense DD4 after shooting it at the expo , but didn't . I would deploy this as a dedicated entry rifle in a heartbeat. Springfield provides a hand stop to keep your fingers from straying in front of the muzzle, but it is somewhat reduced in size. 354K views 4 years ago In this episode of TFBTV, James Reeves reviews the SIG MCX Rattler, a 5.5" PDW in .300BLK that has been purchased for US SOCOM evaluation. Measuring Performance A PDW is not a rifle. In measuring trigger-pull weight, we arrived at an average of about 7.2 pounds. As to the brace, its a Tailhook Mod 2, an adjustable model that does an excellent job of settling in the gun. We also liked the bead-blast finish on the barrel. I really liked the Blue TS2 ,so in the end she was getting one for me for a surprise for my birthday . We think this made the trigger a little more user friendly in that there seemed to be more time for the shooter to completely refine a shot. Sig Sauer New M400 Tread Snakebite SE 5.56 - The Armory Life Our action test was designed to tell us more about trigger response and maneuverability than could be culled from a static benchrest session. Both of them are chambered in uncommon, proprietary bottleneck cartridges, the 5.7x28mm and 4.6x30mm, respectively. MSRP: $700; palmettostatearmory.com, Good advice on the 300 blk pistols Anybody not owning a 300 blk should consider getting one Im 66 years young, big fan of 270,300 magnum but this 300 blk up to 150 yards is great . I fired the Rattler off-hand from 10 and 15 yards with the earlier test loads and a few others, including Winchesters 150-grain Deer Season XP ammunition and Noslers 220-grain BTs. I love my Evo .. You must log in or register to reply here. Sig Sauer SIGMCX Rattler 300 AAC Blackout PMCX-300B-5B-TAP-PSB vs Another latecomer to AR manufacturing, Ruger has proven fast in picking up the rules of the game. Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more. AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. Cookie Notice Our Team Said: When it comes to paying more for a rifle, or any firearm for that matter, its easy to check off a list of features to justify a higher price tag. But I also own several Springfields (M1As in 308 & 6.5cm, Saint Ar15 when it first came out, compact XDe, XDs & XD Mod2 all in 45s, TRPs in 45 & 10mm and the now discontinued Range Officer in 45). The CMMGs single-finger-groove plastic grip is almost extinct because the divider can be uncomfortable and never really seems to be in the right place. The selector switch is bilateral and works just fine. [Review] Sig Sauer MCX Rattler PCB .300 BLK: Ultimate Backpack Gun My wife said I'm going to buy me a new gun which one do you think the Blue or Orange . The A-zone measured 11 inches tall and about 5.75 inches wide. An example that comes to mind is how the handguard that comes stock has mlok that only goes halfway down, and people complain about it getting real hot, and conveniently they sell a upgraded version with mlok that covers the whole thing, and effectively solves . One thing I would like to point out that seemingly even many owners of the Maxim Defense SCW and larger CQB braces and stocks dont seem to know is that you only have to use the button to collapse it. The two most well-known modern PDWs are the FN P90 and the HK MP7. Barrels with twist rates of 1:8 inches and even 1:7 inches have replaced the original-issue lands and grooves that spun the bullets at a rate of 1:9. Sorry for long story .Your CZ Bren are pretty cool looking guns , I got the CZ Evo3 in OD green with SB 3 tactical folding brace on it . Thanks Bio. Type: Semi-Auto Pistol. The M-Lok handguard gives you the ability to attach . Twist rate on bullets is a debatemine is 1:7 on 9 barrel. As to suppressibility, few centerfire rifle cartridges do it better. He is a gun owner and avid reloader from Colorado. Aristotle who said Republics devolve into democracies and devolve into despotism.. Forged rather than cast aluminum is now the standard, and machining is more exact thanks to computer numerically controlled (CNC) automation. Like the MPX, the MCX uses a short-stroke gas piston system, which does away with the need for a buffer system, and the weapon can use a folding stock or no stock at all. Can't wait to find the price on this and see one in person . The 3rd pic is the new Snakebite M400 5.56 Rifle , But It's a stock photo . Completely compatible with average, every day 5.56 ARs, the 300 Blackout upper is a viable route into the caliber (though if you shoot suppressed you might have to up your buffer weight). It may not display this or other websites correctly. Please keep us posted. If we were to describe the bolt lock/release assembly as a seesaw, the typical lower end could be seen as being constructed without the seat. The target to our right showed three A-zone hits and a stray shot in the D-zone, furthest from center. Operating the trigger in a controlled press, the trigger seemed to find two stopping points before finally breaking a shot. A Magpul dual split aperture flip-up rear sight was attached to the top rail that ran the length of the receiver. Yes, we would have preferred a flat-top gas block with rail for attaching a folding front sight, and were not exactly sure how to connect a sling to the front end without pulling on the barrel, but were not sure there is much else wrong. Visually, this made them less obvious. With the desire for a more up-to-date AR-15, we went shopping and found that we didnt have to break the bank just get comfortable within a price range of about $900 to $1250 dollars. Furthermore, the gun is outfitted with Wilsons proprietary handguard, a fairly light affair that is M-Lok compatible and features a 4-inch accessory rail, as well as quick-detachment sling mounts. After all, the eminently suppressible, hard-hitting .30-caliber was tailored for such gunscarbine and smaller that is. That's a $1000 dollar rifle and a good deal at that but you're getting gouged pretty bad at 1400. The rear-sight assembly (sometimes referred to as BUIS or backup iron sight) was a flip-up design. One of the ways that we suspect the suggested retail price of the Saint was held down was by utilizing an A1 front-sight assembly. Probably 2k rounds through it and has always gone bang. Following the success of its initial collaboration with Vertx, Premier Body Armor announces its continued partnership. Starting in 2009, Advanced Armament Corporation (AAC), in cooperation with Remington Defense, took J.D. With the shooter lined up on the center target, the object was to land as many hits as possible into the central A-zone of each paper target within a fixed 10-second time limit. The heavier 120- to 125-grain loads performed similarly. Extraordinary accuracy. The M400 tread is sort of a gimmicky rifle from Sig. I just wish the right-side lever was shorter so it wouldnt bump my trigger finger when flipping it off. Over ten trigger pulls we never got the same reading twice. Each block of calibrated Clear Ballistics gel measured 4 by 4 by 17 inches. Subsonic ammunition, as its name suggests, pushes bullets below the speed of sound. Privacy Policy. With the brace collapsed, it is just 18.75 inches long. models. . Knowing this, I still was dubious when I picked up the PDW from my local FFL. View Product. AR-15 Carbines for Less Than $1300: The Winner is a Saint OK, so they want in sending rounds waaaay downrange. Looks pretty sweet . I usually have to take break between mags. Both short-barreled rifle (SBR) and pistol variants of the MCX Rattler are available. Sig Sauer The AR Pistol Afield. I'm like seriously I could of got the checkmate . Surrounding the barrel and piston system is a 5-inch, free-floating M-LOK handguard. To change the shooters perspective and in effect reduce target area, we staggered the targets. A few times the bolt wouldnt lock back after firing the last round with the SilencerCo Omega 9K in place. June 22nd, 2017, 09:15 PM #2. . Now, we all know stripped down versions just aren't going to cut it, so after adding a Trijicon MRO, SIG SRD 762 QD can, a Magpul vertical grip, a Parker Mountain Machines BCD, and don't forget a fully-loaded magazine of 220 grain subsonic rounds, we have ourselves a stout 9.4 pound setup. SIG MCX Rattler SBR . The only spot on the Rattler is its trigger. I can't get my hands on the DD5 which I really prefer. I have not shot the Tread, I have handled and inspected it though. The base of the grip was hinged to expose a storage space that was water resistant, thanks to a rubber gasket. And After shooting the CZ 75 Tatical sport orange I was in love . Sig 716i or Springfield Victor Saint .308. Thanks to the precise trigger, the shooter always felt he was in complete control. Its solid visual form led us to refer to it as a forend rather than a handguard. SIG MCX Rattler SBR | SIG SAUER The aluminum hanguard is 6 inches long and has M-LOK attachment slots. However, if youre shooting supersonic, its right on target. Maybe i'll sell the .308 if they ship me a new replacement and get an M1A instead, but i'm not exactly dying to give that money right back to them after this fiasco. Pistol: Semi-Auto. Thanks for opening my eyes. Eight major concealed carry insurance programs are now available to the millions of Americans who carry concealed. I really like the trigger in the Saint but the 716i has really good features too. Life has a melody. I really appreciate the input. It was too short. Springfield Armory of Illinois has been producing its own versions of the iconic M1A rifle for many years, but Springfield, like several other manufacturers, is known primarily as makers of handguns, or for that matter bolt-action rifles. Given the paperwork and money you spent on the can, is it worth testing twist-rates theories yourself? The 2nd pic is from the Sig website.. SIG Sauer has just introduced their latest offering in their tread series of rifles with the introduction of the SIG TREAD Snakebite SE. The bottom line? I got the email also Bio. During our action tests, we found the fixed front sight a little distracting, even though we had it aligned (co-witnessed) with our Romeo4 red-dot sight. It began in earnest in the late 1980s. Springfield currently doesnt have any plans for a version in .300 AAC Blackout, but (hint hint) it would be a very smart move, as the .300 BLK performs much better out of short barrels than the 5.56. I will not consider another firearm from the Saint line ever again. The Saint was the only carbine in the test that listed a heavy tungsten buffer among its specs, and it showed by delivering less felt recoil to the shooter. Barrel is Chromemoly Vanadium, Melonite coated inside and out, 1:8 twist and a NATO chamber. FN sells a 16-inch-barreled carbine version of the P90, the PS90, but it looks ugly and awkward and is far from compact. The Black Hills 77-grain OTM was best, producing 0.8-inch-wide groups, and the SIG Sauer 77-grain OTM ammunition produced an average five-shot group measuring 0.9 inch across. Hay Talyn, The 1st pic is of the new Switchblade 5.56 Pistol , Which is a real pic from the LGS. ". Ive tested full-size rifles that werent any more accurate than that. Youll probably need hearing protection with sub- and supersonic ammo. .300 BLK vs 7.62x39mm Designed for rapid deployment from concealment, the MCX Rattler packs a punch in the .300 BLK configuration. The abbreviated configurations of Americas favorite firearm are practically perfect in every way. There was, however, a relief on each side of the handguard about 2.5 inches ahead of the receiver for attaching a quick detach (QD) button-style sling loop. So these two were on my list . Get the 76th edition of the World's Greatest Gun Book. Because I knew the velocity would be lacking, most of my chronographing was done with 5.56 NATO ammo, which runs a bit hotter. Pretty standard, yes, but the 5.56 rendition comes with Springfields forward blast diverter. The civilian version of the U.S. Army's new XM7 rifle. With the Saint Edge series of ARs, you get nicely sculpted lower receivers machined from billet aluminum. Elwood Shelton is an online content developer for Gun Digest. I got my hands on the SBR variant, which features a skeletonized stock that folds flat against the left side of the receiver without obstructing the controls. HKs MP7 has never been available in any commercial form. This is a 100-yard rifle. Meet the all-new Taurus Judge Executive Grade, a revolver featuring a hand-polished satin finish, presentation-grade wood grips, a brass rod front sight and an exceptional hand-tuned trigger. However, the company Match Duo, with a 5.5 break, does a much better job of getting the most out of the pistol. But thats what your 20-inch barreled baby is for, right? Much of their stuff is imported and rebranded. Its so small you barely know its there, and its also rated for sub- and supersonic loads. I recently got the Tread 716i 308, MCX Rattler in 300 BLK and MPX K (completes my collection as I also have the MPX Copperhead and PCC). After comparing the two the Springfield was built better and looked better and had better brace . Its very handy. Definitely looking at the Sig, but having a hard time forking over that much money. Now weve got Springfields PDW in a similarly sized envelope, namely albeit chambered in 5.56 NATO. Before we get there, lets look at the concept of the personal-defense weapon (PDW). For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. M400 tread or Springfield saint victor : r/ar15 - reddit Springfield Saint Edge PDW AR Pistol Review - Guns and Ammo In the confusion the shot was released off line or as one might say, out of time. For sling attachment there was a fixed steel sling loop at the heel of the butt plate, or you could utilize the slot that ran parallel to the buffer tube beneath the cheek piece. *Bullet weight measured in grains, velocity in fps by chronograph and accuracy in inches for best 5-shot groups at 50 yards. Sig Sauer. Maybe they will give me some clarity. The Black Hills 77-grain OTM rounds were next best, showing an average five-shot group measuring about 0.9 inch. I said you really loved shooting the orange . New Shooters Guide: What Is a Pistol Caliber Carbine? Working the charging handle was smooth and revealed no linear movement. The BCM Gunfighter grip provided a steeper angle than the others, including the Magpul grip found on the M400. Eventually, ammo manufacturers answered the call, and now dozens offer 300 Blackout loads for a variety of uses. Thank you for that information, I really needed to know that. It has a nickel boron coating and provides a single-stage trigger pull. Thus, stabilizing subsonic ammo not an issue. Anybody who has experience with these I would appreciate your opinions. You are using an out of date browser. It's perfect for sporting or home defense with high reliability and some furniture and trigger upgrades that set it apart from other budget AR-15s. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. (Tie) B&T .45 2. SIG MCX Virtus & SIG MCX Rattler Rifles | SIG SAUER The SIG MCX Rattler is an incredibly handy rifle that's easy to conceal. PDWs are an established, in-between class of firearm. This five-position brace was specifically designed for PDW-sized guns and only hangs 4 inches off the back of the receiver when fully collapsed. This may be true for some configurations, in certain environments, with particular loads. Handguards are now modular platforms for lights, lasers, and sights, and ambidextrous fire controls are becoming more popular as well. Apr 24, 2017 The upper, including the mix of Picatinnny and Keymod rail, was more modern than the lower, which offered more traditional components, such as the plastic grip with single finger groove and the buttstock that was sans any padding. (Tie) LWRC Smg-45 ($3k?fuck!) Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. However, the range in resistance spanned from about 6.75 pounds to almost 8.0 pounds. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. Hence there are solid copper bullets for high speed applications in 16 inch carbines (1/6 rate or greater) that shoot 300 BLK, but the ammo is expensive. I run the SIG SRD762TI on my Rattler. One last more subtle upgrade was the trigger guard from Bravo Company that left more room for a gloved finger without necessarily having to unlatch the bottom panel. As our tests continued and the trigger broke in, we sometimes experienced only one stopping point before break. Takedown revealed nickel-boron coating of hammer and trigger components, plus a tension screw to fix any gap between the upper and lower ends of the rifle. Im a lefty so the gas hits me right in the face. Sounds like an excuse to get another can like a Dead Air Sandman-S. +1 this is what I ordered for my Rattler. Caliber + 300 BLK; 5.56 NATO; 7.62x39 . This is the MCX Rattler. All Guns and Ammo subscribers now have digital access to their magazine content. Gun Review: SIG SAUER MCX Rattler SBR - The Truth About Guns MSRP: $2,720; sigsauer.com. Bob Meinert, FN Marketing Director, introduces FN's first commercial pistol suppressor, the FN Rush 9Ti. The SIG MCX in a discrete platform featuring a thin, durable folding stock and a 5.5" barrel with PDW upper. The companys thinking must be a suppressor is going on there anyway, so cut costs with the standard muzzle device. I installed it on an AR carbine but ended up taking it off, because while it felt good in my hand, it just didnt look right to my eye. To carry the Rattler discreetly, I used Eberlestocks Combat Office Brief, which represents a typical messenger bag, as well as several other covert packs in my inventory, including some camera bags. I think I've driven myself mad with comparing the pros and cons. Dont be fooled, a 16-inch carbine in Blackout will outperform a 9-inch Blackout pistol. .224 Valkyrie Small Precision Rifle Cartridge: Everything You Need to Know, Buyer Beware: Buying 'Bargain' Guns Can Be Risky. No. I plan on using it primarily for hunting and some plinking. Reptilia sent me one of these compact grips late last year. Operation was very smooth and secure. But I would take the Sig over the Springfield every day of the week, and twice on Sundays. So, as you can see, this is the ultimate platform for a protective detail, SWAT operations where concealability is paramount, or vehicle or home defense with responsible citizens. If the general shape of Springfields PDW looks a little familiar to you, theres a reason for that. In the same breath, the gun is compact enough to enhance its nimbleness, yet big enough to ensure the cartridges ballistic integrity. I have a sig elite which is similar to the tread, no issues solid rifle. SIG Sauer Introduces the New SIG Tread Snakebite SE. It has a cone-within-a-cup two-piece design reminiscent of the Noveske KX3. Get the latest news and reviews from Gundigest.com. (CA Compliant). The lower is mil-spec, so an upper change is no different than any other lower. 7 Things You Need to Know Before Buying an AR Pistol Sig Sauer may have the answer in the MCX Rattler PCB! Listen to both sides of the story before you make a decision based on one magazine article. Essentially it boils down to performance and suppressibility. Springfield XDM Elite 9mm! Is it better than Sig P320 and - YouTube I'll go with the Sig and do those upgrades for sure. We noticed that across all choices of ammunition the Saint produced the most velocity from each round. A spring detent pin was compressed to fold it down. The 300 Blackout pistol model is no different, but few shooters miss the bells and whistles with a gun that goes bang with every trigger pull and hits the mark. Ah, the AR-pistol. The recoil was manageable with the hottest loads, and it was a pleasure to shoot with subsonics. Thoughts on MCX Rattler Canebrake. 300AAC | SIG Talk By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. And when the special operations community began searching for a new 300 Blackout PDW, Sig Sauer provided a solution with the SIG MCX Rattler. The full-profile barrel creates a line that grows from a polymer handguard by Bravo Company that was flat on the sides, adorned with sections of pebbled finish for grip. SIG P320 TACOPS vs Springfield XDM Elite 4.5 Tactical As a result, the American Tactical recently announced the company will offer two new bolt-action rifle systems from Black Creek Labs.